I have found that the GWR ticket purchase system is failing to honour "via" requests but has been honouring "avoid" so you're likely to find that it's missing if you do "via Saisbury" but offered if you do "avoid Reading".  May be that has been fixed and I'm not around long enough to check just at the moment

The plot thickens. Thinking to check Bath Spa - Paddington to compare current costs vs via Salisbury, neither the National Rail site nor GWR will list the super off peak return fare. This might be me: I'll have another look on... another day. (Off peak Bath Spa to Paddington with a railcard comes up at £69.70, the super off peak fare is listed on brfares.com as £50.50).

Mark

There are still two off peak day return fares Bath Spa to London via Salisbury and Warminster there - first class and standard class - according to BRfares. Still there from 2nd January too. Price is £66.20 (adult, no railcard)

If you want something a bit different, try an anytime day return from Portway Park and Ride to London via Warminster and Salisbury at £43.40 - it's restricted in that you may not arrive into Waterloo before 10:00, but there are no restrictions on the return time.

Given the years of diversions east of Reading to Euston looming large,

Fast forward to July 2024: not saying that the loss of the service affected any if the outcomes as there are far greater forces at play* but happy to see the backs of a couple of the transport secretaries who oversaw those times.

Mark

*HS2 phase 2a being a consideration asfar as the rail network is concerned.

I remembered this thread touched on through services in the North East when I saw this news from The BBC


or am I getting confuse with this daily service

07:08 Middlesbrough
07:15 Thornaby
08:13 York
10:20 Kings Cross

15:27 Kings Cross
17:21 York
18:08 Thornaby
18:18 Middlesbrough

Other than the fact this service started at the same time the SWR trains were withdrawn, I'm not sure it makes for a good comparison.  Just the one direct train a day from Middlesbrough, also calling at Thornaby, which have a combined population of more than four times Bradford-On-Avon and Trowbridge.

A train company is planning to scrap one of its train services to London due to low passenger numbers and a lack of trains.

LNER said it would no longer run from Sunderland to London Kings Cross from December, with the service instead starting in Newcastle.

The operator said the service had low passenger numbers since it was introduced in 2015 and passengers could still travel to London using other companies.

1. The extra GWR trains you mention (to Salisbury) only run during the "quiet" part of the day - during the morning and evening busy periods you are back to 1 hourly service and the 58 minute wait at Salisbury for a train to Warminster.

Here comes the irony.  GWR are now running an extra train every hour from Bristol to Westbury, and quite a few of them beyond - five of them to (and terminating at) Salisbury.  From what I've seen they're a mixture of turbos and 158s. And they question has be be asked where the joined up thinking has gone.   It would make so much sense for these units to provide the strengthener units that are added to the Exeter to Waterloo trains routinely at Salisbury and once again provide a through service.  I expect SWR have noticed this internally!

It probably has been good in driving people who are travelling to London from Bristol, Bath and West Wilts onto the more expensive routes via Reading.

I wouldn’t be surprised that there were rumblings. The service was well used and very successful, sometimes a bit too successful based on past experience.

From another source I hear that when the Bristol - Waterloo trains were canned, there was internal rumbling within SWR as it really wasn't a direction people wanted to take, and those rumblings have not subsided.

Affectionate article on Waterloo Station in 'Country Life' magazine

Includes this: "Fewer people are travelling by train since covid. In 2019, Waterloo welcomed 98 million passengers, but that has now fallen to about 41 million per annum."

I'm wondering if that statistic is current...

Mark

https://www.countrylife.co.uk/news/175-years-of-london-waterloo-the-gateway-to-everything-thats-wonderful-258047

That's not strictly true though is it, because they can travel from Bristol to London via Paddington with GWR, which is much faster and more frequent than the SWR service to Waterloo, and a direct service, so they don't have to change?

OK they still have to change at Paddington and use the Underground if they want to get to Waterloo, so in that respect you could stretch a point and say it's "more difficult" but that still represents a considerable time saving from the old Bristol - Waterloo service?

That's not strictly true though is it, because they can travel from Bristol to London via Paddington with GWR, which is much faster and more frequent than the SWR service to Waterloo, and a direct service, so they don't have to change?

The decision to withdraw the direct services is a clear example of how the government's focus on austerity is having a negative impact on public services. The government needs to do more to support the railways, so that passengers can continue to travel easily and sustainably."

What a world we live in. I asked Google's 'Bard' about these trains.



The withdrawal of the direct services has made it more difficult for passengers to travel between Bristol and London. Passengers now have to change trains at Reading, Salisbury, or Winchester, which can add significant time to their journey.

Checking possibilities for a Bath Spa - Woking via Salisbury return trip I was inspired to imagine a world where the onward Salisbury to Southampton route didn't exist, and nor did the line west to Exeter, leaving Salisbury as a through station on a Bristol - Trowbridge - Warminster - Salisbury - Basingstoke - Waterloo line. If you recall that the Beeching era may have seen Salisbury to Exeter shut, at least part of this filght of the imagination is not so fanciful.

If the railway through Salisbury had been reduced to this single route, the likelihood is that it wouldn't have been subject to the frequent poor connections available there.

https://www.southwesternrailway.com/other/about-us/our-plan

(No sign of them reinstating the chunk of the December '21 timetable change on which they didn't consult of course...)

We will modernise and simplify the customer offer, taking into account the full end to end journey experience to improve our customers’ on-train and at station experience.

We will deliver a punctual and reliable train service that meets the needs of our customers through matching capacity to demand

We will maximise and sustain the recovery and growth of our own and whole industry revenues following the pandemic

She's resigned. That has to be a record for the shortest tenure as a minister of state.

It's surprising that there are Tory MPs out there prepared to join a sinking ship.

Michelle Donelan, the MP for Chippenham has been appointed Secretary of State for Education.

Andrew Murrison has resigned from a government post, here's his letter.

Granted there are no through trains from Bristol, Bath, Bradford-on-Avon or Trowbridge to Wimbledon this fortnight, but there are extra calls - I took a look on Saturday:

Arrivals from beyond Basingstoke (Weymouth, Yeovil Junction, etc) at 05:49, 10:32, 11:06, 11:32, 12:06, 12:09 and 12:32

Returning at 18:03, 18:20, 18:33 and throughout the evening until 23:51

South Western Railway's web site on the topic of Wimbledon tennis championships.

They don't seem to be going as far as organising that additional trains call at Wimbledon to ease and encourage travel from further afield. Not sure the extent to which that was done in the past, but it *was* done, and very recently.

Mark


https://www.southwesternrailway.com/destinations-and-offers/sights-and-attractions/trains-to-wimbledon-tennis-championship

The East Putney route is used every day by SWR, pre-Covid there were over 20 movements daily, a bit less today, and mainly ECS but with just a few passenger services. 

Which has also reminded me that route knowledge was such that in the event of Wimbledon to Clapham Junction being unavailable, South West Trains would run services via the rather engineering-heavy surviving down spur at Putney, and now I'm wondering whether the spur is bi-directional, and whether the spur is still used in this way. But this is wandering far from GWR territory...

Mark

Mark ,I know Twitter can be an infuriating experience but I've never known Peter to bight anyone's head off ,in all my years of being there .

Alas, it wasn't around long enough for the internet archive to save a copy.

Mark

It seems perverse than a business that's looking to regrow on travel / tourism / leisure should cease to server the number 2 and 3 travel / tourism / leisure destinations.  Or are they pinning their hopes on promoting travel to such lovely sounding places as Redbridge and Rowlands Castle, Hilsea, Hedge End, Millbrook and Maldon Manor, Raynes Park, Syon Lane, Sunnymeads and Martins Heron.

Article on South Western Railway sponsored research in the Bristol Post.

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/whats-on/shopping/bristol-named-fifth-best-place-7045951

Given that Bristol and Bath are No. 2 and 3 on their list for the South West, I'm looking forward to hearing that South Western Railway will reintroduce services to the two destinations which are still on their network map even if they do not at present serve either of them.

Mark

In view of the often poor connections offered at Salisbury, I've asked South Western Railway to change the routeing guide to permit  travel from Waterloo to Bristol via Southampton. (Not sure when it ceased to be a valid route, does anyone know?)

Mark

Thanks for this. Via Southampton is sometimes no slower. In the evening, there's a three hour slot from 18:20 to 21:20 when the connections at Salisbury are sufficiently dire that the National Rail journey planner advises travel via Southampton - but then if return fares are selected, states 'No fares available'. It's happy to sell an advance fare via Southampton - how an advance fare is available for connecting trains on a route that's supposidly not valid is another matter.

Also, did SWR previously have a blanket ban on the use of off peak return halves of tickets in the evening peak? The National Rail site seems to think this no longer applies & SWR's web site in the way it describes peak travel ticket restrictions... it could be better.

Mark

Is Waterloo to Bristol via Southampton quicker than the normal route?  Is the 2 tph Waterloo to Salisbury ever returning?

In view of the often poor connections offered at Salisbury, I've asked South Western Railway to change the routeing guide to permit  travel from Waterloo to Bristol via Southampton. (Not sure when it ceased to be a valid route, does anyone know?)

Mark

Just to note for the record, the petition closed with 6,572 signatures.

South Western Railway having announced a date at which their services will return to 'Pre-omicron' levels 21st February ....

Cancellations to services on all routes
Due to severe weather some lines are blocked.
What's Going On:
Train services running across the whole South Western Railway network may be cancelled, delayed or revised. Disruption is expected until the end of the day.
What We're Doing About It:
Storm Franklin will cause severe disruption to our network today and we are urging you not to travel.
Storm Franklin expected to lead to high level of incidents across the network
50mph speed limit will cause delays and cancellations
Customer safety and welfare the top priority
Tickets booked for travel on Friday, Saturday, Sunday and Monday will be accepted on Tuesday.
Since Fridays winds of over 90mph, Network Rail have cleared more than 50 fallen trees from our network. We still face challenging weather conditions as the Met Office has issued a yellow weather warning for Storm Franklin until the end of today. With the wind direction expected to change it is very likely that more trees will come down during Storm Franklin, having been weakened over the last two days.
With strong winds forecast, there will be a 50mph speed restriction across the SWR network on Monday to protect the safety of our customers and colleagues, causing delays and cancellations to services. We also anticipate further line blockages due to fallen trees and we urge you not to travel as we regrettably are unable to guarantee replacement travel services will be provided during this challenging time.
We're sorry for the disruption that this is causing and thank you for your patience as we deal with the ongoing severe weather.
Tickets for travel on Friday 18th, Saturday 19th, Sunday 20th or Monday 21st February will be accepted for travel on Tuesday 22nd February. If you are travelling on an advanced ticket on Tuesday 22nd February, please try to travel at a similar time to your original booking.
If you wish to rebook your journey at another time you can do so with no administration fee. If you have tickets dated for travel on Friday 18th, Saturday 19th, Sunday 20th or Monday 21st February and decide not to travel, you will be able to obtain a refund with no administration fee. This may be able to be completed at your local Ticket Office but it depends on the type of ticket you purchased and where you originally purchased your ticket. You must apply for a refund within 28 days of the ticket's expiry date. More information on ticket refunds can be found here: www.southwesternrailway.com/contact-and-help/train-ticket-refunds
For the latest information visit https://www.journeycheck.com/swr/
For more information about how we work with Network Rail to combat delays caused by poor weather conditions, you can visit Network Rails Delays Explained here: https://www.networkrail.co.uk/running-the-railway/looking-after-the-railway/delays-explained/

South Western Railway having announced a date at which their services will return to 'Pre-omicron' levels 21st February - aside from the fact that this feels as though it lags levels of returning passengers rather than anticipating them, I must set to one side that the first omicron cases turned up around the 24th November so on that basis they should really include other casualty of Covid, the Bristol to Waterloos. (OK, that's not First Group that's the government, and I'm really hoping that in due course, along with a couple of other things :-) it turns into an election issue.)

With regard to the pre-Omicron timetable I can confirm this is the one that applied from the timetable change in December 21, i.e. excluding Bristol.

Has Salisbury got a surplus of units now with the Bristol, Penzance, Plymouth and Paignton services all gone?

Has Salisbury got a surplus of units now with the Bristol, Penzance, Plymouth and Paignton services all gone?

Withdrawal of these services would allow the removal of route knowledge between Westbury and Bristol from both Drivers and Guards at both Salisbury and Yeovil Traincrew Depots. Given the limited number of trips this route knowledge is difficult and expensive to maintain, sometimes relying on rest day work. At least one Drivers and Guards turn would be saved each week day. Furthermore, there would be a reduction in fleet and fuel miles with an approximate value of [redacted]  p.a. as well as the avoidance of rail replacement services when engineering work applies. I am also aware that Northern Rail have enquired about the availability of Diesel trains and we also could consider released units for the start up of the Waterside Line.

The likely total saving is projected to be in the region of [redacted] p.a. (some of which is in future costs avoided rather than savings from our current costs).

Through journey opportunities from stations east of Salisbury to those north of Westbury will be removed; however, good connections and alternative services are available for passengers.

GWR services between Salisbury and Bristol have been lengthened in recent years following the introduction of 5 car trains and turbo rolling stock.

Further developments on this corridor are planned through Metro West and other schemes and given projected customer numbers there is little commercial need for SWR services which do not provide part of the regular clockface service on that route.

I did ask about priority seating for the executions but was told that we do not do this anymore.
Spent nearly two weeks on jury service and did not even get to watch a hanging.

I have served on a jury several times, and was not in general impressed by fellow jurors. In one case the other members of the jury followed my lead without any understanding. Whilst I am satisfied that the correct verdict was reached, it was in effect trial by ME rather than by all 12 jurors.

From the Daily Mail
I do hope his comment was a general one, and not related to this particular case - for that was tried by a jury, who's verdict we should respect.  To my knowledge, Mr Shapps was neither present when the incident took place, nor in court during the trial, and he so he should understand the decision made by six men and women selected to look in detail at the case and come to a conclusion.

What does, however, represent a genuine threat to the rule of law is when elected politicians, having not heard the evidence nor bothered to understand the relevant legal principles, attempt to undermine the verdicts of independent juries when the outcome of a criminal case does not meet with their approval. That is a very dark road indeed.